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Thread: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

  1. #1
    snowman123
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    Default long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    Hi,
    I'm planing to build a vivarium, which will house red eye tree frogs. I'm planing to buy the frogs at an exhibition which I will be attending in the autumn, but I will need to make a stop in that city for another day. So it will be a full day and a half before I return with the frogs home. I can drop the frogs at a friends house in that city, so they won't be in the car... but still - it's a relatively long transportation.

    I would really appreciate some help in how to plan this trip to make it least stressful for the frogs. What type of enclosure would be best for such a trip? Anything I need to be careful about? What about feeding? I guess during the stressful time of transport it is better not to feed them, but I'd rather ask... Any help would be much appreciated!

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  3. #2
    Super Moderator flybyferns's Avatar
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    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    We would need additional information:
    Yes.. this is extremely stressful for the frogs as they are already coming off-the-heels of having been transported TO the show.
    -How many frogs
    -How old are the frogs
    -Will you be driving
    -The expected outdoor temps
    -Your level of experience caring for frogs

    If it's autumn - they certainly can NOT remain in the car w/out an on-going heat source- they require a daytime temp of (78-81 °F) and nighttime (72-76 °F)

    http://www.frogforum.net/tree-frogs/...caresheet.html

    Current Collection
    Dendrobates leucomelas - standard morph
    Dendrobates auratus “Costa Rican Green Black"
    Dendrobates auratus "Pena Blanca"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “New River”
    Dendrobates tinctorius "Green Sipaliwini"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “Powder Blue"
    Dendrobates tinctorius "French Guiana Dwarf Cobalt"

    Phyllobates terribilis “Mint”
    Phyllobates terribilis "Orange"
    Phyllobates bicolor "Uraba"

    Oophaga pumilio "Black Jeans"
    Oophaga pumilio "Isla Popa"
    Oophaga pumilio "Bastimentos"
    Oophaga pumilio “Mimbitimbi”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Colubre"
    Oophaga pumilio "Red Frog Beach”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Branco"
    Oophaga pumilio “Valle del Rey”
    Oophaga pumilio "BriBri"
    Oophaga pumilio "El Dorado"
    Oophaga pumilio "Cristobal"
    Oophaga pumilio "Rambala"

    Oophaga “Vicentei” (blue)

    Oophaga sylvatica "Paru"
    Oophaga sylvatica "Pata Blanca"
    Oophaga histrionica “Redhead”
    Oophaga histrionica "Blue"
    Oophaga lehmanni "Red"
    Oophaga histrionica "Tado"

    Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"
    Ranitomeya imitator "Varadero"
    Ranitomeya sirensis "Lower Ucayali"
    Ranitomeya vanzolinii

    http://www.fernsfrogs.com
    https://www.facebook.com/ferns.frogs

  4. #3
    snowman123
    Guest

    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    Thanks for the reply. So, we will buy 3 red eye tree frogs. Age - I don't know... what is generally considered proper age for purchasing frogs?
    I will be driving. The total driving distance is about 4h - so not that much. But after the trade fair I will go to a friends place nearby (30min) to stay over and I would leave the frogs there for the next day when I do my errands... then in the afternoon I'd pick them up and have a 3,5h drive back home.
    Woud that work out? Is it too risky?

    ...My experience with vivariums is 0. I have been reading much for the last few months... but I am building a vivarium now and it should be fully up and running with plants, running water and stable temperature and humidity by the time we go to the fair.
    I have had large tropical aquariums all my life though... so I know how sensitive it is to transport fish over long distances... but no experience with frogs, so any advice would be highly appreciated!

  5. #4
    Super Moderator flybyferns's Avatar
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    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    From my heart, I would not recommend not making the extra stop? It's really making a hard thing harder - for the frog..

    The younger the frog the more difficulty they will have.

    The two most important things to do are :
    maintain the temps
    and re-hydrate the frog

    Do not be concerned if the frog eats ( BUT have a several small crickets available ) They don't eat when they are stressed.

    Supplies for before and during your travel:
    1) bring a small say 2.5 gallon glass aquarium enclosure with a preferably glass lid and a small area left screed open for ventilation
    or a critter keeper (this temp. tank should be not be large= too difficult to maintain things)
    2) a glass aquarium type ** thermometer you can place on the bottom of this temp enclosure.
    **** be very sure the lid is safe and can be safely secured******
    3) a roll of printed paper towels
    4) a spray bottle ( contain properly de-chlorinated water)
    5) an additional gallon of the same water
    6) an overnight type of bag lg enough to hold the temp tank
    7) a cardboard box for the car ---- line the bottom of the box with a towel
    8) a shallow saucer to hold water for the frog to soak in ( water should not be over the frogs chin


    *Try to keep the temp stable. If you think you will be unable to maintain 78F degree - purchase some hand-warmer type packets that can be kept in the the overnight bag /near the temp enclosure--- while monitoring the ** temp carefully

    Get the temp tank ready:
    -line the bottom of the temp tank with a bunch of layers of FLAT paper towel
    -Add de-chlorinated water - enough to see water around the edges of the towel- but not floating

    When you get the frogs:
    WHILE STILL AT THE SHOW:
    Spray the interior of the container well w/ the de- chlor water
    If the frog is in a container /place the frog in it's container --- into the temp tank and safely remove the lid---leave the container there.
    ( you can add 1/4" of water later for the frog to soak - later)
    Do everything possible NOT to handle the frog.
    If the frog is not in a separate container---- simply place the frog into to temp tank you have prepared.
    Place the entire temp tank into the overnight bag. Double check to be sure the lid is secure!!!

    If you have other things to do at the show ---pay for you frogs -- have the breeder hold them --- and take care of you frogs when you are done and ready to leave.

    Keep the frog in as quiet an area as possible.

    The permanent tank:
    Your frog should remain in QT -- Do NOT rush to put the frog into a permanent home !!!!
    It is best to keep things a simple as possible for at least a month to monitor the frog
    ( simple -----> meaning - wet paper towel substrate/ a sprig of plant/ a water dish )

    Additional tips:

    http://www.frogforum.net/general-dis...uarantine.html

    http://www.frogforum.net/tree-frogs/...caresheet.html

    http://www.frogforum.net/general-dis...eder-bowl.html

    Current Collection
    Dendrobates leucomelas - standard morph
    Dendrobates auratus “Costa Rican Green Black"
    Dendrobates auratus "Pena Blanca"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “New River”
    Dendrobates tinctorius "Green Sipaliwini"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “Powder Blue"
    Dendrobates tinctorius "French Guiana Dwarf Cobalt"

    Phyllobates terribilis “Mint”
    Phyllobates terribilis "Orange"
    Phyllobates bicolor "Uraba"

    Oophaga pumilio "Black Jeans"
    Oophaga pumilio "Isla Popa"
    Oophaga pumilio "Bastimentos"
    Oophaga pumilio “Mimbitimbi”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Colubre"
    Oophaga pumilio "Red Frog Beach”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Branco"
    Oophaga pumilio “Valle del Rey”
    Oophaga pumilio "BriBri"
    Oophaga pumilio "El Dorado"
    Oophaga pumilio "Cristobal"
    Oophaga pumilio "Rambala"

    Oophaga “Vicentei” (blue)

    Oophaga sylvatica "Paru"
    Oophaga sylvatica "Pata Blanca"
    Oophaga histrionica “Redhead”
    Oophaga histrionica "Blue"
    Oophaga lehmanni "Red"
    Oophaga histrionica "Tado"

    Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"
    Ranitomeya imitator "Varadero"
    Ranitomeya sirensis "Lower Ucayali"
    Ranitomeya vanzolinii

    http://www.fernsfrogs.com
    https://www.facebook.com/ferns.frogs

  6. #5
    Moderator Mentat's Avatar
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    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    Couple items to add to Lynn's excellent advice. Bring an extra glass floating aquarium thermometer and keep that somewhere near your seat (away from air vents or hot surfaces) so you can monitor temp and adjust heater/AC as needed.

    If driving alone, have to plan all stops for gas, food, and restroom use carefully. A locked vehicle can get cold or hot very fast. Myself drove 6 hours in Summer and in another event 8 hours in a Sunny spring day with Dart frogs needing 75F. Use of drive thru window solved food issue. For gas stops and restroom use, drove into the pump area in the shade and had ice packs in a cooler to place over or beside glass to help keep enclosure cool while I gassed vehicle and used restroom. Could use the same procedure with heat packs when weather is cold. Have a safe trip and good luck !
    Remember to take care of the enclosure and it will take care of your frog !​

  7. #6
    snowman123
    Guest

    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    Guys, thank you very much for such detailed instructions / suggestions how to handle this transport.
    The more I am thinking, the more I realise this might turn out to be quite complicated. If I manage, I will try to avoid a stop - will try to rearrange my schedules. If not possible, you guys gave me plenty of very good advise, so I think we will be well prepared

    Many thanks again!

  8. This member thanks snowman123 for this post:


  9. #7
    Super Moderator flybyferns's Avatar
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    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    Your welcome.
    Enjoy your new acquisition
    When they are settled ----> post some photos

    Oh.......... and BTW welcome to Frog Forum

    Current Collection
    Dendrobates leucomelas - standard morph
    Dendrobates auratus “Costa Rican Green Black"
    Dendrobates auratus "Pena Blanca"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “New River”
    Dendrobates tinctorius "Green Sipaliwini"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “Powder Blue"
    Dendrobates tinctorius "French Guiana Dwarf Cobalt"

    Phyllobates terribilis “Mint”
    Phyllobates terribilis "Orange"
    Phyllobates bicolor "Uraba"

    Oophaga pumilio "Black Jeans"
    Oophaga pumilio "Isla Popa"
    Oophaga pumilio "Bastimentos"
    Oophaga pumilio “Mimbitimbi”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Colubre"
    Oophaga pumilio "Red Frog Beach”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Branco"
    Oophaga pumilio “Valle del Rey”
    Oophaga pumilio "BriBri"
    Oophaga pumilio "El Dorado"
    Oophaga pumilio "Cristobal"
    Oophaga pumilio "Rambala"

    Oophaga “Vicentei” (blue)

    Oophaga sylvatica "Paru"
    Oophaga sylvatica "Pata Blanca"
    Oophaga histrionica “Redhead”
    Oophaga histrionica "Blue"
    Oophaga lehmanni "Red"
    Oophaga histrionica "Tado"

    Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"
    Ranitomeya imitator "Varadero"
    Ranitomeya sirensis "Lower Ucayali"
    Ranitomeya vanzolinii

    http://www.fernsfrogs.com
    https://www.facebook.com/ferns.frogs

  10. #8
    Moderator Mentat's Avatar
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    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    Missed you are a new member, welcome to FF !
    Remember to take care of the enclosure and it will take care of your frog !​

  11. #9
    snowman123
    Guest

    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    Many thanks!

    ...It was indeed my first post - but not last! Will post soon with vivarium construction / design ideas, to hear your opinion and I'm sure I'll have tons of questions as we go along with this new project

  12. #10
    snowman123
    Guest

    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    As promised, here are a few photos of the new inhabitants (the blue dart frog is plastic and was put in there before we put live frogs in; it has since been removed...).
    I have some concerns though: we bought 3 frogs, but had to buy from 2 different vendors: 2 are a bit younger and are from one vendor and 1 is a bit older - still young - from another vendor. They all looked very healthy.
    Now that they are in their new home, the two smaller ones are really dark when awake... they are lively and walk around and jump, eat crickets etc. So they don't exhibit signs of being sick, but their skin is really dark (see pictures). The third frog is a normal light green colour (not in the pictures - it was hiding this time). During the day when the frogs are asleep, all are nice proper light green colour. All sleep very peacefully...
    So, my question is: should I be worried about the darker colour when they are awake?
    I have plenty of experience with aquariums, but not with vivariums... and with fish, when they turn dark it's a clear sign of either sickness or stress, and action should be taken asap.
    Please advise.

    many thanks!

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  13. #11

    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    Hello! What you are seeing it pretty typical of most amphibians. They tend to change colors to blend it better out when they are reacting to the temperature around them. Any other members can correct me if i'm wrong, but it sounds like it is just camouflaging. I hope this helps!

    0.1.0 Psuedacris regilla
    0.1.0 Pseudacris regilla (r.i.p. Green Beauty)
    0.0.1 Bufo boreas boreas? (r.i.p. )
    0.0.4 Dendrobates tinctorius 'Powder Blue'

  14. #12
    Super Moderator flybyferns's Avatar
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    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    Thanks for the update.
    A darker - solid- color is not a concern.

    Just wondering ?
    Did you QT them?
    http://www.frogforum.net/general-dis...uarantine.html

    If no QT, there is really no reason to separate them now. Just keep a very close eye on them which is difficult to do when they are on substrate and in a completed/planted enclosure. ie It's difficult to monitor who eating what and how much. It's also difficult to keep an eye on the poop. For example....If they have been together , and one frog develops diarrhea ....all 3 will have to be treated.

    Be prepared / find a herp vet that can do fecal studies for you w/ out demanding to "see" the frog.

    I QT newly acquired frogs for a minimum of 30 days. Some are QT'd for months.

    Current Collection
    Dendrobates leucomelas - standard morph
    Dendrobates auratus “Costa Rican Green Black"
    Dendrobates auratus "Pena Blanca"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “New River”
    Dendrobates tinctorius "Green Sipaliwini"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “Powder Blue"
    Dendrobates tinctorius "French Guiana Dwarf Cobalt"

    Phyllobates terribilis “Mint”
    Phyllobates terribilis "Orange"
    Phyllobates bicolor "Uraba"

    Oophaga pumilio "Black Jeans"
    Oophaga pumilio "Isla Popa"
    Oophaga pumilio "Bastimentos"
    Oophaga pumilio “Mimbitimbi”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Colubre"
    Oophaga pumilio "Red Frog Beach”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Branco"
    Oophaga pumilio “Valle del Rey”
    Oophaga pumilio "BriBri"
    Oophaga pumilio "El Dorado"
    Oophaga pumilio "Cristobal"
    Oophaga pumilio "Rambala"

    Oophaga “Vicentei” (blue)

    Oophaga sylvatica "Paru"
    Oophaga sylvatica "Pata Blanca"
    Oophaga histrionica “Redhead”
    Oophaga histrionica "Blue"
    Oophaga lehmanni "Red"
    Oophaga histrionica "Tado"

    Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"
    Ranitomeya imitator "Varadero"
    Ranitomeya sirensis "Lower Ucayali"
    Ranitomeya vanzolinii

    http://www.fernsfrogs.com
    https://www.facebook.com/ferns.frogs

  15. #13
    Moderator Mentat's Avatar
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    Default Re: long transportation of new frogs from and exhibition

    The issue with missing quarantine is that if frogs have a pathogen and develop a disease; in quarantine enclosure you would throw away paper towel and sterilize silk plants/fake branches and water dish. In a vivarium... you would have to throw away everything that can't be sterilized; which is pretty much the whole thing !
    Remember to take care of the enclosure and it will take care of your frog !​

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