Grey tree frogs - interbreeding?

[Jayzie Greenfrog]

Hi, does anyone know whether the two kinds of Grey Treefrogs can breed together? Im in the UK have grey tree frogs but I think I may have a mixture of versicolor and chrysoscelis and am wondering whether they would be able to breed together?

[Bombina Bob]

this might be possible, the genetics and alleles are very similar.

[Jayzie Greenfrog]

Thanks, It looks like it might be a case of waiting and letting nature do whatever it is going to do, if that makes sense! I was was just wondering if anyone has any experience with their own mixed group!

[Bombina Bob]

If they do breed, their offspring would be infertile because of the genetic code. Same thing with a donkey and horse, mix the two and you get a mule

[Jayzie Greenfrog]

I hadnt thought of that but it sounds right unfortunately. Then of course I have no way of knowing if someone had the same problem my captive bred babies could be from mixed stock?! I am right am I that there is no easy way to tell the two species apart?

[Bombina Bob]

the two are very hard to tell apart if not impossible, Im not 100% sure if you can even tell them apart but now that i have done specific research, they wont crossbreed i apologize The copes and gray have the same call but the cope's has a slower pace. The females will be attracted to specific members of their own species. I did not even think of that before!

[UncleChester]

They will hybridize in nature. If you have access to jstor, here's an article JSTOR: An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie (there are many other papers on hybridization of north american hylids). It also looks like the hybrid offspring keep some fertility (end of the first paragraph of that article).

Telling them apart is easy with a calling male. You can find sound recordings here: ARMI - Frog and Toad Calls

Otherwise chromosome count or comparison of blood cell sizes (and I think also the cells that make up the 'sticky' bits on the toes) I think are the way to go but not really practical for most people.

[Jayzie Greenfrog]

Hi Ryan and Brian your comments and interest are much appreciated. I had hoped to get a breeding group going but it looks like things are going to be rather complicated!! I have spent much of the afternoon comparing recordings of the frogs to a recording made of my males. I have come to the conclusion that my two, who were supposed to have been wild caught males, could be Hyla Chrysoscelis although they were sold as Versicolor as were the 6 newly acquired babies! I have had our adult female for so long i doubt she was sold as anything other than "Grey Tree-frog" the shop i rescued her from was so awful and had long gone bust they wouldn't have known. It looks like getting a breeding group together is not going to be easy and that is probably why not many people do it! �� i certainly don't have access to microscopes to check chromosomes or compare blood cells although many many years ago I trained as a Laboratory Assistant Not that that would help much these days!

[MsBlueRose]

I had the same problem while trying to identify and properly sex my Copes Greys. I did a lot of research with a lot of different sources including but not limited to internet site and recorded calls from both species and contacting the local conservation area management offices to fin out which variety are more often found in my area. After much thought, I concluded that I have 2 Cope's Grey males and a mystery female, lol. As was mention by another contributor, I don't have access to a lab and a microscope, lol. Would be nice though! I think my little girl is a Copes' too, simply because that is the most common species in my area though you can still run across a Hyala v. on occasion. They truly are amazing little frogs. My youngest male was mistaken for an ordinary green tree frog when I got him. He was always the same color (for months - almost a year actually). He was this brilliant lime green just like the green tree frogs, the only thing is he has those cheek marks just like the other 2 frogs I have Plus, no white lines on his snout, just a cute little rounded nose. But when he decide to change color for the first time, we got to see how pretty he really was. Unlike the other frogs who's patterns where outlined in a dark colored black or brown, his patterns are outlined in gold. He is so pretty, I don't think I will ever see another grey as unique as he is. I will post some pics of him when I have good lighting to show his gold rimed designs. If anyone else has seen a grey like ours please let me know. I am looking for another one a pretty as him. Thanks!

[Jayzie Greenfrog]

Sorry it has taken time to respond, I was really interested to read of your efforts to Identify your greys. We have the problem here of having no way of knowing where they came from originally. I have a old grey female who was supposed to have been captive bred but I don't trust the shop it was going bust and knew I did not want to buy W/C frogs. Then I have 2 W/C young males both calling must be just about fully grown now. Finally we come to the 6 babies who are captive bred but I don't know who or where the breeder is quite often these come in to us from breeders in Europe! So it looks like i will have quite a mixture. I had wanted to try to breed them but I shall be content to have a healthy happy group of frogs.

I should love to see a pic of your frog he sounds beautiful. A couple of years ago We had a bright blue, yes blue european green (only in this case blue lol) tree-frog he was beautiful but didn't grow properly and we lost him far to young. These babies all seem to prefer a slight green colouring at night and one of the adult males is more often than not almost pure white, but nothing as beautiful as you describe.

[MsBlueRose]

I will catch him on a sunny morning while he is sun-bathing and snap some pics of him and the other 2 in his group, I want to share his unique coloring with everyone. I would love to know if anyone else has anything like him or if h is just one of a kind? I think he is amazing and I want one more that looks like him; but that may be only a dream... I intend to look for one though, lol. I have to wait for my camera adapter to come in though before I can post anything. I seem to have misplaced mine so I had to order a new one, opps... lol. Thank you realizing how much footwork I put into IDing my frogs. It was a real task, but IMO it was worth it. I just wish I could be sure my little girl is a Cope's Grey, too, but I can't afford genetic testing, lol.