My Bully just die this morning

[Kevin Illidan]

Last night he's still ok, jump all over the box when i feed him a superworm. I used to feed him shrimps (just as big as a superworm), but yesterday, i got some superworms for my geckos, and give him one, he try to hunt the worm, but after a few miss, i went to feed my geckos... Then this morning i wake up to this... the superworm is still alive, can anybody tell me what is wrong
Did the superworm kill my bullfrog?

[Lija]

so sorry for your loss it is very sad.
it is hard to say what was a cause based on information provided. you can always opt for necropsy done. but if a question is if superworm can be a cause of death the answer is yes, but not directly, especially if a frog was fed shrimp before, and it will happen over time. lots of things can be gone wrong here, you can answer to trouble in the enclosure questions,. so we can suggest some, it won't help this frog unfortunately, but might help if you get another.

[Kevin Illidan]

or did he just freeze to death, it's like 18-20 Celsius here, but i think that's not enough to kill him, right?
and WHY is he showing his belly? if he die, shouldn't he just die sitting like always? Why this upside down

[SCF]

Even though I have not had a frog death since I was a lot younger, they tend to die upside down. I have a feeling it was the shrimp. Bacteria of some sort. The superworms should not cause death at all.

[SCF]

Oh and I'm sorry for your loss, he is in a better place now. =)

[Kevin Illidan]

oh thank you for that, maybe it's the shrimp, that's quite a lesson for me, he's all healthy, eat like a pig and boom, he's in that pose
hope he's in better place.

[SCF]

I have a feeling it was, but like LIJA suggested, you may want to answer the trouble in the enclosure questions, so we can help give advise for future reference.

[Kevin Illidan]

sorry but i don't really understand the "answer the trouble in the enclosure questions" part, i'm new here, and as you can see, English is not my mother language

[Lija]

Sorry we should have been more clear, please answer to these questions so we can go over

“Trouble in the Frog Enclosure” The following information will be very helpful if provided when requesting assistance with either your frog or enclosure. To help with your questions, please utilize the below list and post the information in the proper forum area to get advice from FF members that keep the same frog. This will allow for little confusion and a faster more informed response.


1. Size of enclosure?


2. # of inhabitants - specifically other frogs and size differences?


3. Humidity?


4. Temperature?


5. Water - type - for both misting and soaking dish?


6. Materials used for substrate?


7. Enclosure set up i.e. plants (live or artificial), wood, bark and other materials. - How were things prepared prior to being put into the viv?


8. Main food source?


9. Vitamins and calcium? (how often?)


10. Lighting?


11. What is being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure?


12. When is the last time he/she ate?


13. Have you found poop lately?


14. A pic would be helpful including frog and enclosure (any including cell phone pic is fine)


15. How old is the frog?


16. How long have you owned him/her?


17. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred?


18. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats?


19. How often the frog is handled?


20. Is the enclosure kept in a high or low traffic area?


21. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning, etc)




by Lynn(Flybyferns) and GrifTheGreat.

[Heatheranne]

Answering each question helps us to try and figure out what may have caused the death of your frog.

Welcome to the forum. I'm sorry for your loss. Always sad to lose them .

[Mentat]

I'm very sorry for your frog's death . When you say shrimp; do you mean freshwater prawn and crayfish or saltwater shrimp? Feeding saltwater shrimp to vertebrates not used to them, can cause problems over time.

[Kevin Illidan]

ok, now there you go my friends

1. Size of enclosure?
It's a Plastic box 20x25cm

2. # of inhabitants - specifically other frogs and size differences?
Nope, only him

3. Humidity?
I don't measure because i fill the box with water (about 1-2cm deep) and black sponge

4. Temperature?
18-20, can drop to 15 celsius at night.

5. Water - type - for both misting and soaking dish?
Rain water (boiled, cooled)

6. Materials used for substrate?
Sponge

7. Enclosure set up i.e. plants (live or artificial), wood, bark and other materials. - How were things prepared prior to being put into the viv?
Nope

8. Main food source?
As a baby, i feed him some meal worms, superworms, then move up to little fish, river shrimp - i dont know the word (live and frozen/thawed, head removed of course)

9. Vitamins and calcium? (how often?)
as i feed him fish and shrimp, i think he got enough calcium, only dust the worms with calcium with d3 couple times

10. Lighting?
Nope

11. What is being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure?
I live in Vietnam, so the temp in pretty good for him (28-31), it's just getting cold for a few days, but it's still at 20, i have a heat pad prepared when it's getting colder but...

12. When is the last time he/she ate?
The night before yesterday, last night i leave the superworm with him, he didn't make it.

13. Have you found poop lately?
yeah, like a lot

14. A pic would be helpful including frog and enclosure (any including cell phone pic is fine)
oops, i cleaned it up.

15. How old is the frog?
i bought him a month ago, when he little as thumb nail.

16. How long have you owned him/her?
1 month 5 days.

17. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred?
it's captive bred from China

18. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats?
i feed him daily in the afternoon or evening. Around 4-6 pm

19. How often the frog is handled?
not a single time. I'm too busy taming my Nile monitor

20. Is the enclosure kept in a high or low traffic area?
well, it's on the desk at corner of my living room.

21. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning, etc)
i clean it once a week

[Truffs1178]

Three problems I can see from your answers is the temperature, food and cleaning. The cage should be cleaned daily Andy since you had it in one of those sponge and water setups the bacteria builds up fast. Also crickets, worms, roaches etc are better foods than meal worms and shrimp, much more nutritious, safer and easier to digest. 20 degrees is too low for an African bullfrog.

Sorry for your loss.

[Kevin Illidan]

Thank you very much, i must have been too careless to him...

[Truffs1178]

Are you planning on getting another?

[Kevin Illidan]

not really, no, i like him but maybe right now i don't have much time for another, i'll try to take care of my monitors, and my leopard geckos. Maybe next year, i'll get another one.

[Tongue Flicker]

My condolences

[Mentat]

Hi Kevin! Do you have a photo of Bully when alive? One of frog and one of full set-up would be nice. Taming a Nile Monitor ?

[Cap10Squirty]

Taming a Nile Monitor ?

I know what you mean. I've been able to get my Ornate monitor to climb my shoulder if I sit next to the enclosure AND I dangle food in front of it haha. By tame you basically want to look for this: no biting, and no whipping. Keep calm and the animal should calm down over time. Don't expect it to perform tricks though!

[Kevin Illidan]

Oh sorry i didn't take any photo of him, he's growing quite fast, so i don't feel like making a growth chart for him
And by taming, maybe i've used the wrong word, i'm not teaching him any tricks, just trying to get him stay, and feel comfortable, and safe on my hand... but he's still too fierce. Not biting, not whipping tail anymore, but still too scared of almost everything when i take him out of his enclosure. Ornate sure is much more calm compare to a Nile... I want to keep an Ornate too, but can't find any in both Vietnam and China It's a very beautiful creature.