African Dwarf Frog Won't Eat ! Advice Needed ...

[FrogMinch]

Hi,

I have an ADF who has suddenly started refusing his food and I don't know what to do.

He was eating without any problems before and has always been a feisty little thing but it's been about 5 days now and he just turns his nose up at everything I offer him. I'm afraid he won't last much longer without eating something.

He usually eats frozen bloodworms, so when he started refusing these I tried him on live ones, with no success. I then noticed that the filter wasn't working properly ( although the water chemicals were all Ok, Ph was around 7-8 ) so I bought a new filter and changed 15% of the water, then again a few days afterwards ( amphibian dechlorinator used ). Still nothing, so I tried a bigger water change and cleaned the tank, getting all the uneaten food out of the bottom and scraping the algae from the sides. Still not interested. The water temp remains the same as ever, he's got plenty of places to hide and hang out. He shares the tank with a Bamboo Shrimp, who has a very healthy appetite and they always get along well. I also tried different food - last night, some krill - previously he couldn't get enough of those, but he just floats sadly on the top of the water now. I started to drop in some frog vitamins last night, as recommended by the pet store, hoping he would absorb some and start to feel better, but nothing so far.

I also have red bellied frogs and I have a supply of small crickets - could I try him on one of these?

He has no real physical symptoms - stomach may be a "bit" bloated but not enough for dropsy ( as far as the pictures on the internet are any guide ) - I would assume him to be bloated up properly if this were the case, but he's Ok. No red leg. No sores, no visible fungus, just a hungry frog.

My research finally suggests he could have a bacterial infection since the symptoms are "lethargic, refusing to eat, and spend a great deal of time floating at the surface in one spot."... If this is the case, what is the best treatment, I read about a product called Maroxy - would this help? Aquarium Salt?

At a bit of a loss and getting desperate for some advice, since I don't want to lose him to something preventable - any advice much appreciated ( by myself as well as the frog )

By the way, he is in a two gallon tank ( I read that 1 gallon per frog is Ok, and he has always been healthy )

Thank you,
Matthew

[FrogMinch]

Anyone there?

[FrogMinch]

Looks like i posted this in the wrong forum before, hopefully i will have more luck here ...


I have an ADF who has suddenly started refusing his food and I don't know what to do.


He was eating without any problems before and has always been a feisty little thing but it's been about 5 days now and he just turns his nose up at everything I offer him. I'm afraid he won't last much longer without eating something.


He usually eats frozen bloodworms, so when he started refusing these I tried him on live ones, with no success. I then noticed that the filter wasn't working properly ( although the water chemicals were all Ok, Ph was around 7-8 ) so I bought a new filter and changed 15% of the water, then again a few days afterwards ( amphibian dechlorinator used ). Still nothing, so I tried a bigger water change and cleaned the tank, getting all the uneaten food out of the bottom and scraping the algae from the sides. Still not interested. The water temp remains the same as ever, he's got plenty of places to hide and hang out. He shares the tank with a Bamboo Shrimp, who has a very healthy appetite and they always get along well. I also tried different food - last night, some krill - previously he couldn't get enough of those, but he just floats sadly on the top of the water now. I started to drop in some frog vitamins last night, as recommended by the pet store, hoping he would absorb some and start to feel better, but nothing so far.


I also have red bellied frogs and I have a supply of small crickets - could I try him on one of these?


He has no real physical symptoms - stomach may be a "bit" bloated but not enough for dropsy ( as far as the pictures on the internet are any guide ) - I would assume him to be bloated up properly if this were the case, but he's Ok. No red leg. No sores, no visible fungus, just a hungry frog.


My research finally suggests he could have a bacterial infection since the symptoms are "lethargic, refusing to eat, and spend a great deal of time floating at the surface in one spot."... If this is the case, what is the best treatment, I read about a product called Maroxy - would this help? Aquarium Salt?

The pet shop said they dont think its a bacterià infection, although they did not see the frog. I tried anotjer pet shop and he reckons îts food poisoning and suggegsted i try giving him dropsophilia flies, which i will try later. He actually said that bloodworms were poisonous, which surprised me since hes been eqting those since he arrived here...

At a bit of a loss and getting desperate for some advice, since I don't want to lose him to something preventable - any advice much appreciated ( by myself as well as the frog )


By the way, he is in a two gallon tank ( I read that 1 gallon per frog is Ok, and he has always been healthy )


Thank you,
Matthew

[Mentat]

Sorry your frog is not well . Please answer the below questions to try and figure out what is wrong. Pics of frog will help determining if frog is bloated or point to some condition too. If a bacterial infection is present; you have to make sure the meds are safe with your shrimps. Most invertebrates are very sensitive and will die if exposed to many vertebrate medications. For mild bacterial infections myself prefer Melafix at same dosage level as for fish. For cases where unknown fast multiplying bacteria are an issue; Maracyn Plus is better.

Bloat can be caused by either bacteria (frog feels hard, usually stays at tank top and worsens quickly) or renal/lymph node failure (frog feels softer, stays in water column and can live like this for a longer time). The first can be treated with fast acting antibiotics like Maracyn Plus. The second with Epsom Salts or a draining with needle type intervention by veterinary. Obvious challenge to last procedure is the frogs small size. Good luck !

“Trouble in the Frog Enclosure”

The following information will be very helpful if provided when requesting assistance with either your frog or enclosure. To help with your questions, please utilize the below list and post the information in the proper forum area to get advice from FF members that keep the same frog. This will allow for little confusion and a faster more informed response.

1. Tank Size and volume of water in it (full, 1/2 filled, etc.)?

2. Number of inhabitants including all frogs and any fish?

3. Water source and any conditioner treatments?

4. Water Temperature and how is it heated (if so)?

5. Water chemistry levels: pH; Ammonia (NH3); Nitrites (NO2); Nitrates (NO3)? Note that if you do not have test kits, most aquariums/pet shops will do complimentary tests if you take a clean water sample.

6. Describe any filter system including model and media?[/COLOR]

7. Substrate type?

8. Tank set-up (plants (live or artificial), driftwood, hide outs and other decor? - How were things prepared prior to being put into the tank?

9. Main frog staple food and any treats? How often you feed?

10. CA, vitamins, and any other additives used (how often)?

11. Lighting set-up and hours it's used?

12. When is the last time frog ate?

13. Have you found poop lately?

14. A picture would be helpful including frog and tank (any including cell phone pics are fine).

15. How old is the frog?

16. How long have you owned him/her?

17. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred?

18. Any medications in the water (treatment dosis and for how long)?

19. Any salt in water (how much)?

20. Is the tank kept in a high or low traffic area?

21. Describe tank maintenance to include water changes, cleaning, media changes, etc.).


By Lynn(flybyferns), GrifTheGreat, and aquatic questions added by Carlos(Mentat)

[FrogMinch]

Hi,

Thank you for your reply, I really appreciate it.

Unfortunately, the little froggy died last night and I found him floating on top of the tank this morning

I had spoken to a pet shop yesterday and they sold me some live Artemia, which they said might perk him up. They also put me through to one of their suppliers, a frog enthusiast, who drove to our place on the way back from a delivery in Germany, and arrived at 8pm in the pouring rain to give me some advice as well. He said that Bloodworms ( not exclusively my little frog's diet, but probably about 90% ) were so high in iron that a bloodworm heavy diet would eventually lead to iron poisoning and he thinks this is what killed the little guy. I've not heard that before - I appreciate that having a variety of food is important, and we had actually started to put amphibian vitamins into water once a week, and I used to mix up the food a little between the usual frozen stuff ( he also said don-t feed him frozen, they lose nutrition that way )… We also had an issue with the freezer a few weeks ago and some bloodworms defrosted for a few days. I kept them outside in the cold, but perhaps it wasn't cold enough, and he continued eating them so I figured they were not off. Maybe I was wrong.

Anyway, thanks a lot for your advice, I think these little things are a learning curve but it's disappointing and sad to lose one if I did something wrong. I guess I'm looking back over the past few weeks and wondering what it was - he had alway eaten bloodworms, so why overdose now? Plus, would he still eat food that was bad?

Thanks,
Matthew

[Mentat]

Sorry your frog died Mathew ! Have not heard of iron poisoning so can't discuss that. IMO the frog had a bacterial infection (semi-bloated and floating symptoms) and those can be very fast acting deadly pathogens. Maybe the unfrozen food went bad; but appears your shrimp are OK with it.

Introducing a frog to that aquarium right now is not a good idea; so try not to replace frog right away and maybe wait at least 30 days to let possible bacteria bloom die down. Would check in local pet shop and see if your shrimp will tolerate any bacterial treatment to help sanitize aquarium a bit before getting another frog .

[AmphibianAwesomeness]

Now I know Ill sound like an idiot once I figure it out, but, what does ADF stand for?

[Mentat]

...what does ADF stand for?

African Dwarf Frog .

[Mentat]

Looks like i posted this in the wrong forum before, hopefully i will have more luck here ...

I've merged your threads to avoid confusion. In the future please start only one thread per issue and avoid double posting in different sub-forums, thank you !

[Geoff]

I'm sorry that you've lost your frog and cannot speculate about the cause, which is impossible for anyone here to determine. I will, however, offer the following comments on what you've written to try and stem the flow of misinformation that Internet forums like this sometimes create.

He said that Bloodworms ( not exclusively my little frog's diet, but probably about 90% ) were so high in iron that a bloodworm heavy diet would eventually lead to iron poisoning and he thinks this is what killed the little guy. I've not heard that before

As far as I know, there's no substantial evidence to support that notion. Although there's some controversy amongst fishkeepers about the wisdom of feeding bloodworms, they're only likely to pose a serious threat to small fish that cannot digest or excrete the chitin, which the bloodworms' exoskeleton is made up of. I kept Hymenochirus frogs for around 20 years and never experienced any problems feeding them bloodworms and neither did anyone else I knew personally who kept them.

I appreciate that having a variety of food is important, and we had actually started to put amphibian vitamins into water once a week

I have no idea what amphibian vitamins consist of, how the frog could utilise them effectively or what possible adverse effect they may have had on the water chemistry. If you don't know either, they may not have had the beneficial effect intended.

I used to mix up the food a little between the usual frozen stuff ( he also said don-t feed him frozen, they lose nutrition that way )

I agree that live food is preferable to frozen food but, again, I kept these frogs for a number of years when their staple diet was frozen foods. I used to alternate between frozen bloodworms and frozen Artemia. Not only did they thrive on that diet but they also produced viable eggs. So, again, based on many years of personal experience, the advice that you've been given is questionable because there's no evidence of any significant nutritional deficiency as a result of freezing that I'm aware of.

.