WOW...Something is weird.

[NialR35]

I just found my frog half buried in this VERY weird VERTICAL position, arms out and extended and he looked so stiff that I thought he was dead. Scared the heck out of me.... I panicked and poked him a bit with the rubber tongs to see if he was going to move and after like 3 seconds he did so I sprayed some water on him to see if he would do something, then just sat there in a normal position but that was very weird....Any thoughts on this? I have never seen him in such position, he looked dead for a second...and I mean dead because when I opened the cover he did not even move at all.

He did not eat much last night compared to the past two weeks, he seemed scared and went under the plants and "hid" there after 2 pieces. Also last night when I lowered the temps and raised humidity he started jumping a little bit, hitting the glass like if he was trying to get out or something, weird. Just thought I'd mention this.

Another thing, I have no seen yet "big" poops like they normally do, I just have found small circular clunks of what appears to be poop in the water. Is it normal for these frogs to do small amounts every couple of days or they are supposed to have a bowel movements of once a week?

[SCF]

Did it's skin appear to be moist? Did you notice how it was breathing? How damp/dry is the substrate? Has it's water bowl been very messy on a constant basis? Is the water you are using in it's bowl dechlorinated?

The scared part of it jumping at the glass would suggest stress.

The little chunks of feces you notice are just because you are using earthworms, that is perfectly normal, big harder feces is normally when you are feeding something with an exoskeleton.

[NialR35]

Skin was moist because 10 mins before I found him like that he was in his water bowl. I did not notice his breathing, he wasn't moving at all because I observed him for about 20 seconds before I poked him and half his lower body was buried.

Substrate is always misted on the side where the lamp hits, the "cold" side next to the water bowl has more moisture. I try to keep the substrate with more moisture on the bottom so when the frog buries it can cool off better. I clean his water bowl every night and I use dechlorinated water for everything.

He did jump a couple of times last night after 2 weeks, I don't know if it was because I lowered the temps, turned out the lights and misted on the glass and he was trying to catch water drops thinking it was food? He didn't go crazy but I heard him headbutting the glass a couple of times.

The chunks are very small....my ornate is also eating nightcrawlers and he goes once a week and does a big package. What really freaked me out was the half buried in a vertical position, with his arms extended out like if he was going to hug something, looking stiff but when I poked him he kinda like got out of that trance state.

He has been eating well except for last night that his appetite seemed a lot less than the past two weeks; only ate two pieces and went under the plants "hiding". Then I offered two more pieces 10 mins later and he ate them under the plant..maybe it was the calcium that he tasted first and turned him off.

[SCF]

One thing we have never discussed here (that I know of) and does not exactly pertain to this issue is playing dead. The very first time I saw a pyxie play dead, my girlfriend and I freaked. It's arms were extended out, but this was in the water dish. They do this often, and in a jokingly manner we just say "oh, so and so died." I've never observed this in the substrate though and this does not seem to be the case. It sounds like it is toxing out. That's why i'm asking some questions on water/setup etc. What have you primarily been feeding it as of last week? The jumping issue I do not think is a concern.

[SCF]

Also how wet do you think it is on the bottom of the substrate? The reason I ask is because if it's overly wet, it easily can breed bacteria and fungus, which will affect the frog.

[GrifTheGreat]

Sounds like Toxing Out to me. Need more habitat information.

[NialR35]

I thought it could be toxing out as well....I changed his water last night after feeding so he can have fresh clean water for the night since he spends the majority of the night in there. I did notice the water a little dirty this morning but I did not pay much attention to it since I change the water EVERY night no matter what. I scald his dish with HOT tap water, and rinse it with treated water prior to putting it back.

The substrate is not really wet, just moist. There are no puddles or white mold anywhere. It does look dryer in some parts because that's where the lamp hits. I have been feeding night crawlers for the past two weeks to go easy on him since I just got him. Eating has been great until last night when I noticed him not as aggressive as other days and ate only around half of what he normally would.

One thing I did do was give him a bigger water bowl, its only the medium sized zoo med one. I washed it and treated it prior to using it and kept the water level to under his chin.

[SCF]

Simple question, but do you rinse off the earthworms before you feed? How are you storing them? Does their substrate smell "off" in any way? You can also mix the eco earth around into the dry stuff and help get rid of the overly wet.

[NialR35]

1. Size of enclosure? 10 gal

2. # of inhabitants - specifically other frogs and size differences? 1

3. Humidity? 73-80%

4. Temperature? 82-83F daytime; 78F nighttime

5. Water - type - for both misting and soaking dish? Dechlorinated water for everything.

6. Materials used for substrate? Eco earth

7. Enclosure set up i.e. plants (live or artificial), wood, bark and other materials. - How were things prepared prior to being put into the viv? Water bowl, plastic plant, tree log, covered on all sides and a small stripe in the bottom front of the tank.

8. Main food source? Night crawlers

9. Vitamins and calcium? (how often?) Ca+D3 x3/ Mul-vit x1 per week.

10. Lighting? 50 watt tight beam bulb with dimming lamp.

11. What is being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure? UTH on side and lamp.

12. When is the last time he/she ate? Last night, but about 45% less compared to the last two weeks.

13. Have you found poop lately? I always find small brown clunks in the water, seems to be small poops compared to the big weekly ones from the ornate. They both eat the same thing.

14. A pic would be helpful including frog and enclosure (any including cell phone pic is fine)

15. How old is the frog? I would say around 1 month and a half or less. I got him when he was a little over an inch SVL.

16. How long have you owned him/her? 2 weeks

17. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred? CB

18. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats? So far I have only fed Canadian night crawlers.

19. How often the frog is handled? Never.

20. Is the enclosure kept in a high or low traffic area? No traffic at all.

21. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning, etc) Water changes are done on a daily basis every night after feeding. Have not done a monthly cleaning yet.

[NialR35]

Simple question, but do you rinse off the earthworms before you feed? How are you storing them? Does their substrate smell "off" in any way? You can also mix the eco earth around into the dry stuff and help get rid of the overly wet.

Yea, I rinse the night crawlers with treated water prior to cutting. I keep them refrigerated too. Their substrate does not smell at all and the worms look healthy, nice and round without sores or bumps.

[SCF]

18. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats? So far I have only fed Canadian night crawlers.

I believe the reason is this here.

[SCF]

Even giving some crickets will help diversify it's diet. Too much of a good thing can be a bad thing.

[NialR35]

18. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats? So far I have only fed Canadian night crawlers.

I believe the reason is this here.

You really think so? How could that cause it the weird position I found him in? Well I can get waxworms, hornworms, crickets and some florida keys broad head roach or something like that. I guess I could buy a pack of waxworms and use them as treats....but how often do you feed treats? Once per day along with the nightcrawlers?

I always try to keep humidity at 80% but what is a good range? I think 60-80% is good right?

I just noticed him sitting there with his eyes kinda closed, like if he was squinting but when I get closer to take a look he opens them wide. Is this him/her trying to sleep or there is something wrong?

[GrifTheGreat]

I don't think its the lack of diversity because that is what the Vitamins are for.

What kind of dechlorinated water are you using? Tap, spring, distilled, R/O, or purified?

[SCF]

I really do think so. It's not getting enough of diverse nutrition that is vital to it's health. For example, I've had my newest baby a week longer than you, I've fed it earthworms, dubia, a pinky, morio worms, crickets, hornworms, and a few silks.

You do not need to keep at it 80% humidity, lower is ok as well.

[SCF]

The vitamins in no way can replicate diverse insect nutrition, imo.

[NialR35]

I don't think its the lack of diversity because that is what the Vitamins are for.

What kind of dechlorinated water are you using? Tap, spring, distilled, R/O, or purified?

I'm treating tap water with repti safe.

What about the playing dead part that SCF mentioned?

[GrifTheGreat]

The vitamins in no way can replicate diverse insect nutrition, imo.

True, but that is not the reason for the frog to act this way. It is most likely environmental or neurological. Spasms and paralysis are associated with toxig out as well as frantic behavior.

[GrifTheGreat]

Mine doesn't play dead, but they will lay motionless for long periods of time with arms and legs slayed while sleeping in their water.

[NialR35]

Dang...I just hope my baby is okay. He has been doing awesome all this time, I really don't know what could have caused this. I doubt it was changing the water bowl, I noticed the tank has this silicone inside that holds together the pieces of glass on every edge...I don't think the frog rubbing/touching this silicone when he buries could be causing this right?