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Thread: Is this Red Leg?

  1. #1

    Default Is this Red Leg?

    It seems the problems with my new frogs never end...
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    The camera exaggerated the colour a little, but compared to my other frogs of the same species (litoria aurea) it's not looking good.

    He's about 1" long and living in an Exo-Terra mini/tall with 4 other frogs of the same species and size while being quarantined ( they'll be split up in a couple of weeks). They're all juveniles of approximately 4 months.

    I bought them in an online auction and picked them up Saturday just gone. The previous owner had them living in a bark substrate and was feeding them mealworms, with no supplements.

    This has already caused problems in one of the frogs, if you refer to an earlier thread of mine.

    His colour should be golden-bronze, but he's more of a muddy brown, which suggests something is off...

    What should I do? If its red-leg, how do I treat it? Only on Sunday I disinfected the whole terrarium due to the other frog being sick, so this is a real slap in the face.

    If dragons were real I'd totally be in on that...
    1 German Shepherd X- Badger

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  3. #2
    aegillesp
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    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Laputa's legs always look a little purplish red, but they've been like that for a while, even while her leg was broken. Which I'm sorry if it doesn't relate, but your frogs legs look the way Laputa's did while she was sick... Her arms did that too while she was sick, but has since gone away, and I haven't noticed her back legs being purplish anymore, maybe in a few small areas?

  4. #3

    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Quote Originally Posted by aegillesp View Post
    Laputa's legs always look a little purplish red, but they've been like that for a while, even while her leg was broken. Which I'm sorry if it doesn't relate, but your frogs legs look the way Laputa's did while she was sick... Her arms did that too while she was sick, but has since gone away, and I haven't noticed her back legs being purplish anymore, maybe in a few small areas?
    Hmm... interesting.. I'm hoping that the little guy's just stressed out, but I'd like someone to try confirm for me :/

    If dragons were real I'd totally be in on that...
    1 German Shepherd X- Badger

  5. #4
    Super Moderator flybyferns's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Sorry Gabby ,
    It's very difficult to tell.

    These little guys are giving you sleepless nights.
    It is very difficult for WC frogs to adjust to captivity.

    I'm sure you know; the first thing to do, however, is to isolate him form the others.

    There may be somewhere you could have him tested: Frog Safe, Inc is a great site!
    This sites also has additional information including great cleaning tips:
    FDR Inc. The Australian Diseases - Chytrid Fungus Treatment Techniques

    http://www.frogsafe.org.au/home/

    Red leg looks like broken vessels. Sadly when this is seen the disease is far along.

    If you should see any broken skin - use an antibiotic ointment, such as Tritop or Neosporin ( WITHOUT PAIN RELIEF)
    I have read bad things about Reptoheal and Newskin --causing additional problems on the extra fragile skin of their inner legs.

    Lynn
    Current Collection
    Dendrobates leucomelas - standard morph
    Dendrobates auratus “Costa Rican Green Black"
    Dendrobates auratus "Pena Blanca"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “New River”
    Dendrobates tinctorius "Green Sipaliwini"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “Powder Blue"
    Dendrobates tinctorius "French Guiana Dwarf Cobalt"

    Phyllobates terribilis “Mint”
    Phyllobates terribilis "Orange"
    Phyllobates bicolor "Uraba"

    Oophaga pumilio "Black Jeans"
    Oophaga pumilio "Isla Popa"
    Oophaga pumilio "Bastimentos"
    Oophaga pumilio “Mimbitimbi”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Colubre"
    Oophaga pumilio "Red Frog Beach”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Branco"
    Oophaga pumilio “Valle del Rey”
    Oophaga pumilio "BriBri"
    Oophaga pumilio "El Dorado"
    Oophaga pumilio "Cristobal"
    Oophaga pumilio "Rambala"

    Oophaga “Vicentei” (blue)

    Oophaga sylvatica "Paru"
    Oophaga sylvatica "Pata Blanca"
    Oophaga histrionica “Redhead”
    Oophaga histrionica "Blue"
    Oophaga lehmanni "Red"
    Oophaga histrionica "Tado"

    Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"
    Ranitomeya imitator "Varadero"
    Ranitomeya sirensis "Lower Ucayali"
    Ranitomeya vanzolinii

    http://www.fernsfrogs.com
    https://www.facebook.com/ferns.frogs

  6. #5

    Default Is this Red Leg?

    Thanks for the info, Lynn
    I'm about to go to bed lol, but I've isolated him... I went to the Frog Safe website and saw their Betadine bath instructions, might give that a go tomorrow morning, or maybe a saline/salt bath... Hopefully he pulls through ok :/

    I just wish that the previous owner had taken better care of these froggies so she didn't end up dumping all their problems on me! Haha..

    If dragons were real I'd totally be in on that...
    1 German Shepherd X- Badger

  7. #6
    Super Moderator Heatheranne's Avatar
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    Default Is this Red Leg?

    I'm so sorry this is happening. Please update us.

    I'm not sure either. Are any of the frogs eating?
    https://m.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10203589094112277&id=1363241107&set =a.1434844115446.2055312.1363241107&source=11&ref= bookmark

  8. #7

    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Quote Originally Posted by Heatheranne View Post
    I'm so sorry this is happening. Please update us.

    I'm not sure either. Are any of the frogs eating?
    I don't know yet. As of yesterday, Mr Blobby (the impacted one) wasn't, but I'll try again today. I haven't tried to feed the other little guy yet.. but same story, I'll give it a go.

    If dragons were real I'd totally be in on that...
    1 German Shepherd X- Badger

  9. #8

    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Trouble in the Enclosure...

    1. Size of enclosure? Exo Terra Mini/Tall: 30cm x 30cm x 45cm


    2. # of inhabitants - specifically other frogs and size difference? Originally 6 frogs: 3 approximately 1" long, and 3 slightly under. This has since been reduced to 5, then 4 as two frogs have gotten sick and are now isolated in hospital tanks. I know there were far too many frogs in the tank. Please do not lecture me. It was a rescue circumstance from an inept owner, and they will be split between two tanks as soon as quarantine period is over. I will also be onselling two frogs.

    3. Humidity? Unknown, I don't have a hygrometer, but I mist once or twice a day.

    4. Temperature? Unknown, but they're in a fairly warm bedroom with a heater on at night.

    5. Water - type - for both misting and soaking dish? De-chlorinated tap water.

    6. Materials used for substrate? Original owner used bark and large smooth gravel. I removed the bark and disinfected the gravel. After having to do a tank deep-clean for the second time yesterday, I replaced the gravel with paper towels (plain white, moistened).

    7. Enclosure set up i.e. plants (live or artificial), wood, bark and other materials. - How were things prepared prior to being put into the viv? Artificial plants: one silk climbing one attached to the glass with a sucker, one silk Exo-Terra plant with resin base. Both plants are large and provide plenty of cover. There were also two other small plastic flowers that the previous owner had in there, but I have long since removed them and put them in the hospital tanks (disinfected) for some sort of cover.

    8. Main food source? Up until I got them almost a week ago, their main diet had been unregulated feeding of mealie worms and flies. However, the frogs would just get lazy and gorge on the slow moving mealies. Since coming to me, I'm ashamed to say I've only fed them twice. I'm going to feed them again today. I feed wingless fruit flies which are dusted with calcium+ D3.

    9. Vitamins and calcium? (how often?) Up until coming to me, the frogs have never been supplemented. I haven't managed to get food into all of them, but they have calcium with D3. I am trying to get a multivitamin ASAP when transport allows.

    10. Lighting? No lighting. I read on a care sheet somewhere that litoria Aurea don't need the range of humidity regulators, lighting etc as some tree frogs do. Also lighting is expensive, and I can't afford a light for each viv.


    11. What is being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure? Refer to temp.

    12. When is the last time he/she ate? Unknown.

    13. Have you found poop lately? Hard to say. I found a poop while cleaning the vivarium, but I don't know which frog it was from. Hence the separation I now have.

    14. A pic would be helpful including frog and enclosure (any including cell phone pic is fine)

    15. How old is the frog? Approximately 4-5 months old.

    16. How long have you owned him/her? Coming up to six days, however I've owned my other tiny GGBF since March from a tadpole.

    17. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred? I would assume captive.

    18. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats? Refer to earlier food question. No other feeders used as treats.

    19. How often the frog is handled? I am trying to handle as little as possible, but since it is the first week of me owning it, I am having to handle more than I'd like. However, I'm trying to make it brief and am handling with moist clean hands.

    20. Is the enclosure kept in a high or low traffic area? Low traffic- Corner of my bedroom downstairs, next to the garage.

    21. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning, etc) Water change every day, check for feces every day and remove, clean substrate once a week. Hospital tanks: Paper towelling and water is changed daily.

    Hope this can provide some insight, I've tried to answer them as fully as I can.

    If dragons were real I'd totally be in on that...
    1 German Shepherd X- Badger

  10. #9

    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Hmm, how bizarre. Perhaps it was a false alarm. Just checked him this morning, no red legs. Pale, creamy colour just like the rest of the frogs. I'll continue to keep an eye on him though, just to be sure..

    *EDIT: I'm feeding all the frogs now, and he doesn't have an appetite.. I'm wondering if he might be having the same problems as my other frog, i.e impaction and tetany resulting from calcium deficiency..

    If dragons were real I'd totally be in on that...
    1 German Shepherd X- Badger

  11. #10
    Super Moderator flybyferns's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueKiwiOca View Post
    Hmm, how bizarre. Perhaps it was a false alarm. Just checked him this morning, no red legs. Pale, creamy colour just like the rest of the frogs. I'll continue to keep an eye on him though, just to be sure..
    Oh ...That's good to hear!

    Gabby,
    How did you acquire them?

    Care sheets:
    Golden Bell Frog
    Green & Golden Bells Frog (Litoria aurea)
    Frogs of Australia > Litoria aurea / Green and Golden Bell Frog

    Gatta get a thermometer!!!!

    Lynn
    Current Collection
    Dendrobates leucomelas - standard morph
    Dendrobates auratus “Costa Rican Green Black"
    Dendrobates auratus "Pena Blanca"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “New River”
    Dendrobates tinctorius "Green Sipaliwini"
    Dendrobates tinctorius “Powder Blue"
    Dendrobates tinctorius "French Guiana Dwarf Cobalt"

    Phyllobates terribilis “Mint”
    Phyllobates terribilis "Orange"
    Phyllobates bicolor "Uraba"

    Oophaga pumilio "Black Jeans"
    Oophaga pumilio "Isla Popa"
    Oophaga pumilio "Bastimentos"
    Oophaga pumilio “Mimbitimbi”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Colubre"
    Oophaga pumilio "Red Frog Beach”
    Oophaga pumilio "Rio Branco"
    Oophaga pumilio “Valle del Rey”
    Oophaga pumilio "BriBri"
    Oophaga pumilio "El Dorado"
    Oophaga pumilio "Cristobal"
    Oophaga pumilio "Rambala"

    Oophaga “Vicentei” (blue)

    Oophaga sylvatica "Paru"
    Oophaga sylvatica "Pata Blanca"
    Oophaga histrionica “Redhead”
    Oophaga histrionica "Blue"
    Oophaga lehmanni "Red"
    Oophaga histrionica "Tado"

    Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"
    Ranitomeya imitator "Varadero"
    Ranitomeya sirensis "Lower Ucayali"
    Ranitomeya vanzolinii

    http://www.fernsfrogs.com
    https://www.facebook.com/ferns.frogs

  12. #11
    Super Moderator Heatheranne's Avatar
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    Default Is this Red Leg?

    I agree, you really need a hygrometer and thermometer.

    I'll send you a PM .
    https://m.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10203589094112277&id=1363241107&set =a.1434844115446.2055312.1363241107&source=11&ref= bookmark

  13. #12
    Super Moderator Heatheranne's Avatar
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    Default Is this Red Leg?

    Could you try some pinhead (tiny baby) crickets? If you do, try the glass bowl method...use a 1 1/2 to 3 inch sided bowl to put them in. They will learn to feed from the bowl. Remove any uneaten crickets daily to feed the crickets and then offer them to the frogs again. It's easier to keep track of how many are eaten.

    Offer some fruit flues each night. Try not to add too many to the tank unless you see them eat a few so there aren't tons running around.

    Do they ever soak in their water bowls by themselves?
    https://m.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10203589094112277&id=1363241107&set =a.1434844115446.2055312.1363241107&source=11&ref= bookmark

  14. #13

    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Thanks, Lynn and Heather, for the info and PM

    Lynn, I "rescued" them from an inept owner on a local online auction. They were originally used as educational tools at a kindergarten but sadly not very well cared for.
    Heather, I can ring the pet shop/ BioSuppliers and see if they sell pinhead crickets, if they do, I'll order some and give the glass bowl method a whiz sounds a lot less stressful than fruit flies to be frank!

    I actually feed them in a separate, smaller tank so I can get an idea of how much they're eating. Is this ok to do? It minimizes the tank cleaning I have to do lol.

    I have occasionally seen them soaking themselves... occasionally mind you, so not very often. Do you think they're not hydrated enough?

    If dragons were real I'd totally be in on that...
    1 German Shepherd X- Badger

  15. #14
    Super Moderator Heatheranne's Avatar
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    Default Is this Red Leg?

    If you mist the tank a couple times a day that will help. I'll read a bit more about their species and see if I can find the proper humidity for them.
    Last edited by Heatheranne; July 19th, 2013 at 03:19 PM.
    https://m.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10203589094112277&id=1363241107&set =a.1434844115446.2055312.1363241107&source=11&ref= bookmark

  16. #15
    EmJay
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    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Quote Originally Posted by Heatheranne View Post
    If you mist the tank a couple times a day that will help. I'll read a bit more about their species and see if I can find the proper humidity for them.
    From what I've read, ideal humidity is officially 75%, but they cope at 65-85%. I don't know this from experience, just advice. I've never had a problem with humidity in an ordinary tank, although I do have a lot of water in there.

    Temps in captivity average 15-25 deg C (although I've been told they can handle up to 30C under a basking lamp as long as it's localised and the rest of the tank is lower), but in the wild it can get down to freezing and they don't die off so..?

  17. #16
    EmJay
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    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueKiwiOca View Post
    Heather, I can ring the pet shop/ BioSuppliers and see if they sell pinhead crickets, if they do, I'll order some and give the glass bowl method a whiz sounds a lot less stressful than fruit flies to be frank!
    Bio-suppliers do "small" crickets and "baby" locusts, but you'd have to ring them for exact sizes, I think.

    I have occasionally seen them soaking themselves... occasionally mind you, so not very often. Do you think they're not hydrated enough?
    Bell frogs are usually quite aquatic. Mine spends most of her time in the water, and my outside frogs when I was little would hang out in the water underneath the lily pads, regularly swam to a depth of 30-40cm, and didn't spend a lot of time out on the rocks or plants.

    Perhaps yours have just not naturally learned to swim/bathe yet, because they were originally kept with only a water bowl as babies? Bells usually like a good 8-10cm water depth, with 1:2 water-to-land ratio.

  18. #17

    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Quote Originally Posted by EmJay View Post
    Bell frogs are usually quite aquatic. Mine spends most of her time in the water, and my outside frogs when I was little would hang out in the water underneath the lily pads, regularly swam to a depth of 30-40cm, and didn't spend a lot of time out on the rocks or plants.

    Perhaps yours have just not naturally learned to swim/bathe yet, because they were originally kept with only a water bowl as babies? Bells usually like a good 8-10cm water depth, with 1:2 water-to-land ratio.
    Are they? I've noticed my little Froakie likes swimming around more than the new frogs do... but even he doesn't swim a whole lot. Although if I put him in his "pool" he'll stay there and bather for a while.

    As for the 8-10 cm depth and 1:2 water to land ratio, it looks like I have a bit of work to do... I have nothing like that amount in my current set-ups (maybe 1" depth and 1/4 of the tank in Froakie's tank, and just small water dish in the Exo-Terra with the newbies). Thanks for the advice

    If dragons were real I'd totally be in on that...
    1 German Shepherd X- Badger

  19. #18

    Default Re: Is this Red Leg?

    Update: The poor little guy still hasn't eaten. I'm not sure what's wrong with him, but he's certainly looking off colour; compare him to my other juveniles who are eating voraciously and jumping happily around the terrarium, brightly coloured.

    He's still a muddy brown, no appetite... I think I'll give him another honey bath, because he might still be a bit bunged up. He doesn't have the fine body line that the rest of the frogs and Ned have (once his impaction was cleared), which suggests a little bloating. If I can get him to pass poo, I'll offer food again and maybe force feed... He hasn't eaten in a very long time and I'm getting concerned :/

    Just thought I'd update (and bump lol)

    If dragons were real I'd totally be in on that...
    1 German Shepherd X- Badger

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