Need help with a PCF habitat.

[photohutch]

Hi all,

A relative newbie, though--we've managed to keep several Pacific Chorus Frogs alive for nearly two years. I'm not very happy with the current habitat and was looking for suggestions on where to turn for suggestions on a new one. The current set up is a converted reptile 20 gallon terrarium with about 1/3 of it a water feature (with aeration/filtration that is nearly nonexistent). We have a new addition to the family, Chompy--an Alligator Lizard, that is probably better suited for the terrarium. Any suggestions on an appropriate habitat (and source) for the frogs?

Thanks!

Steve

[Gnag the nameless]

Sorry for a lack of replies, usually we respond much faster than this.

Could you be more specific on the amount of Pacific Chorus frogs you care for?

I've heard that the rule of the thumb with these chorus frogs is that 2 can go into a 5 gallon, and for every extra frog add 5 gallons. So, 4 could go into a 15 gallon tank, and 5 a 20 high tank.

If you need advice for substrate, coconut fiber is good to use with PCF's. My own live quite happily on it. Just be sure to provide leaves and other hiding spots.

As for water, a simple water bowl can do the trick, preferredly relatively deep, and wide with edges that are each to grasp. A leaf or twig leaning against the side of the bowl can help any swimming frogs get out.

Misting the environment daily or every other day is recommended.

Take a look at this caresheet, it may give you the answers you need:

Frog Forum - Pacific Chorus Frog

[photohutch]

Caspian,

Thanks for the reply. Sorry for my delayed response, been out for a few days.

We have four in a twenty gallon terrarium, though I'm moving them into a 20 gal aquarium. The lizard is moving in to the terrarium and I doubt the two species would coexist very well.

The current set up has a 10x8x3 plastic container full of water (has a gravel bottom). Substrate in the rest of the container is organic, unfertilized planting soil. Also there is a plant, a log with several hiding spots and lots of leaf litter.

The article is indeed very helpful, but after seeing some of the vivariums online, I felt an inadequate host. Our little guys have nothing to climb on, save the glass. Was thinking of adding some taller wood and plants. Also, thought about adding a water feature of sorts. Doubt I'm ready for a water fall, but maybe a simple creek.

Any suggestions for plants? Are little creeks and such worth the work for the PCFs. Will the really breed in only 5 inches of water, and if so, how do you handle water changes, etc?

Thanks!

[deranged chipmunk]

if you had your little ones for 2 years, then rest assured, you are far from an inadequate host. amphibians only have a few basic requirements to meet, which you obviously met for 2 years. all the fancy vivs you see are basically for the owners.

as far as how to build, your best bet is to peruse the vivarium section of the forum. there you will find pages upon pages of build journals, as well as answers to almost any question you could have. then get yourself a game plan. don't worry, there is plenty of support here to help you along with your build.

[Gnag the nameless]

Bill is right, most of the fancy decor you see in terrariums and vivariums is for the eye, not the frogs.

For my two little rascals, I have 2 fake plastic plants on the back wall, which look good against the wallpaper, as well as fake plastic leaves scattered around on the ground providing good hiding spots and (how Chrome and Levi view it) protection from predators. For you, a small log and various twigs leaning against the back wall can be useful, and also, those fake vines you see at the store can work, as well as leaves. One thing I must stress is a background, preferably a forest one. It will make the frogs feel more comfortable and also look nice as well. I can upload a picture of my frogs tank if you want.

If you do take anything from the outside, boil it in dechlorinated water for 5-10 minutes to remove any possible bacteria or unwanted visitors from outside. If you get driftwood from the store, wash it very well to remove any sea salt. Organic Unfertilized planting soil is perfect. Just refresh it every month or so.

A 20 Gallon aquarium will work fine. Just make sure that lid is on tight! I once didn't put the lid on tight enough, and somehow both of my little rascals escaped. I found my red, larger male, Chrome, climbing up the side of my juvenile bullfrogs tank, but you'll never guess where I found little Levi: In the big tank with the bullfrog! I'm lucky I spotted that little rascal before my big chubby eating machine did, or else someone could've ended up as froggy dinner! I cannot stress how important it is to have a good lid for these guys, and how careful you must be to put it on properly. These frogs are the best escape artists I've ever seen!

A large plastic container or little creek will do fine. I use a small clay pot, it looks great against the cocoa fiber and leaves. It's also relatively deep and wide, with edges that are easy to grasp, as well as part of the fake plant lying in it, allowing the frogs to rest in the water.

I'm not sure about the 5 inch water rule, I only have 2 males, and have only kept them for about a month now, so I'm far from an expert and a lot less experienced than you with these guys. However, I'd assume that relatively deep water would be suitable. As for filtration, I just refresh 100% of my frogs water whenever they (for lack of a better term) poop in it.

[photohutch]

Thanks for all the suggestions and help.

I think I have an idea how to proceed with the project, but am not sure of the outcome yet. I want my daughter to help design it, but basically, the design will incorporate a five or six inch deep pond that is six by twelve. I found a small reptile pond filter that we can design into the pond. We have some wood already in the existing set up, but we found some really beautiful driftwood recently that should allow the frogs to climb (too big to boil, it's soaking now to hopefully eliminate salts). We will add a couple of plants, and probably some small lilies in the pond, hopefully for eggs and tads. . . .Okay, I'm dreaming.

I have some acrylic for a divider that I plan to secure and make water-tight with silicone. Is aquarium silicone required, or will regular clear silicone work? I figure regular is okay, as I've read that pond foam is common in vivariums, and that has to be filled with chemicals that apparently don't hurt the frogs.

Finally, I noticed some foamy egg type things attached to our outdoor pond filter grate. Would any of you attempt to bring those into the new set up to see what hatches?

Thanks again!

[Gnag the nameless]

No problemo. It's what we do here.

For a filter, the Fluval U underwater filter series has done me magic for my big chubby eating machine of a bullfrog. I use a Fluval U2 Underwater filter, and her water has not gotten even the slightest bit cloudy ever since I put that filter in her tank. But it's your choice. A canister filter would work too, but they're very expensive.

You can buy fake water lilies that float really well and look pretty at the Mr Pets. I use them for both my Green frog and Bullfrog's tanks.

With a nice water area like that, eggs and tadpoles aren't a dream, but a possibility.

Honestly, I'd go with the aquarium silicone. Although it will cost a bit, it's better than risking it and having your hoppers get hurt.

Eggs? Hmm... I'd buy a 5 gallon or 10 gallon tank, place a underwater sand substrate on the bottom with some plants, fill the tank with dechlorinated water, place the eggs in, and wait. If the tadpoles do hatch, you can feed them frozen, then boiled lettuce crushed into tiny pieces, as well as bloodworms and "Frog pellets". Make sure to thaw the bloodworms before feeding them to the tadpoles.

[deranged chipmunk]

Thanks for all the suggestions and help.

I think I have an idea how to proceed with the project, but am not sure of the outcome yet. I want my daughter to help design it, but basically, the design will incorporate a five or six inch deep pond that is six by twelve. I found a small reptile pond filter that we can design into the pond. We have some wood already in the existing set up, but we found some really beautiful driftwood recently that should allow the frogs to climb (too big to boil, it's soaking now to hopefully eliminate salts). We will add a couple of plants, and probably some small lilies in the pond, hopefully for eggs and tads. . . .Okay, I'm dreaming.

I have some acrylic for a divider that I plan to secure and make water-tight with silicone. Is aquarium silicone required, or will regular clear silicone work? I figure regular is okay, as I've read that pond foam is common in vivariums, and that has to be filled with chemicals that apparently don't hurt the frogs.

Finally, I noticed some foamy egg type things attached to our outdoor pond filter grate. Would any of you attempt to bring those into the new set up to see what hatches?

Thanks again!

here's a thread i wrote a while back about supplies you can use:
http://www.frogforum.net/vivarium-te...-supplies.html

and here's my mantella thread, gives you an idea on some techniques:
http://www.frogforum.net/vivarium-te...aludarium.html

i normally don't post links to my threads, but since i'm bored, i had time to search for them....lol