White's tree frog dragging left back leg

[xXxHeavenxXx]

Hi everyone

While taking care of my other sick little guy..we noticed something very strange with my other whites tree frog. He is dragging what seems to be the very bottom of his hind back leg and toes. As of earlier today, he was just fine. We dust his crickets nearly every time he eats so I don't think its MBD. He just ate yesterday (dusted crickets) and he was jumping and acting normally. I don't know if he injured himself jumping around? Is there anything I can do for him? He's flipping over when he is trying to jump and climb walls so I am extremely worried! He's not a calm frog..and tends to move, jump and play often..and getting him to calm down now is hard..we finally transformed his tank into a hospital tank..andn got him to relax in some warm bath water.

Is there anything we can do for him to help? All toys are already out of his tank.

[flybyferns]

HI Lisa,
Sorry..... just saw this.
How is he today?
I have to go to work - I'll be back on later
I hope he's better
Lynn

[xXxHeavenxXx]

HI Lisa,
Sorry..... just saw this.
How is he today?
I have to go to work - I'll be back on later
I hope he's better
Lynn

Hi Lynn

No hes not any better today. He tries to climb the tank and then falls . His toes are all curled up and hes just dragging at the very least the bottom 3rd of his leg. I don't know for sure whats going on with him. Does something like this heal by itself? We are away from the vet here =(

[deranged chipmunk]

this definitely sounds like something you should discuss with a vet. there are many links to Dr. Frye on here. I just don't have it handy on my phone. maybe someone will post his info soon. good luck with the little one.

[tinkgirl77]

Here's the post that had all his contact info plus lagniappe , hope it helps!

Frog First Aid Medications - Being Prepared

Hi All,
Dr. Frye sent me an email that I wanted to share with you all as to medications one should have on hand in case your frog is needing medical attention and a vet is no where to be found.
Dr Frye is very nice and willing to assist but it is highly recommended that photos be attached to the email if your looking for assistance.
Dr Frye can be contacted at dr.frye.vetatmilan@gmail.com

The meds listed below can be bought from Dr Frye if you live in the U.S. Note that prices may have changed since this was sent to me. If you live outside the U.S. you can track down a local vet and purchase the items.

Here is the email I received:
As a first aid kit, I strongly recommend having a few drugs on hand at all times. That way when a medical problem arises, you just need to contact me, and I can steer you down the right path.

Metronidizole is an antibacterial, antiprotozoal, and APPETITE STIMULANT. It is $30 per 100 mLs.

Silversulfadiazene is a topical antibiotic and antifungal that promotes healing while discouraging scarring. It should be used on ALL skin lesions and costs $34 per ounce.

Baytril is a strong systemic antibiotic that needs to be mixed carefully. It costs $24 per ounce and is mixed according to the size of the frog treated. Only a few drops are used daily.

Panacur is a powdered dewormer. It is very safe and easy to use and costs $14 per spoonful.

Shipping costs $11 for Priority on any order that includes one of the liquid medications. If you purchase Panacur alone, shipping costs $2. I can not ship medications outside of the United States.

You can pay by PayPal at dr.frye.vetatmilan@gmail.com , or by calling my office at 734-439-2273 and paying via credit card over the phone.
My hospital is not open on Wednesdays, so please take that into account.

End of email

.:* Lisa *:.
laissez le bon temps roulet! :-)

[xXxHeavenxXx]

top back foot. curling those toes. I have a vet that I am currently away from because I am moving/packing. Any ideas? Ive been doing some research and it seems that there's not much I can do if its an interior injury except wait til it heals and if its a deficiency well I'd take care of that. Any way to tell? I don't see anything visible on the foot or the leg.

[flybyferns]

Hi,

For those members unaware of Lisa's struggle ( just want to mention this)--- Lisa has provided OUTSTANDING care to these two frogs since she purchased them. This leg issue is developing in her 2nd frog. Like others members here on FF there have been problems! Her other has been under a vets care for quite some time . (members might recall the little frog with the ‘clicking ’ sound. ) She has made an exhausting effort to get him better and is still faced with have to force feed him. These problems came with her frogs. Like others here, she is battling to fix two frogs that were purchased this way !! So BRAVO, Lisa. Like others, without her good care. Gosh knows what the outcome would be - by now.
----------------------
Lisa,
Your additional information with the photo, here, is very helpful. Looking at the photo I believe that both back legs are affected. (The L more so than the R) A paralysis looking symptom like this, of the hind legs, can be as a result of more than one reason. He could have and injury ? Watch for little improvements. Can he poop? If so, this is a good sign. Does he ever spread out all the digits (toes) on the other extremities, including the fronts?

An infection can cause this; even impaction? As you know the most common cause is calcium/vitamin D3 deficiency leading to MBD. If these were my fogs I would ask for both to be x-rayed. This may answer questions: is the clicking sound in one frog the result of a stress fractured jaw? And, are the curling toes the result of under calcified bones? If this were to provide an answer you would have an evident goal in treatment! There would be less worry of over supplementation.
----------
This is how my ---mini-mind-----understands it: ( Lisa, I hope you don’t mind I use your current example of diligent care and challenges as a motivation to post the following information)

Vitamin D3 is needed for the proper absorption of calcium from the frog’s gut during digestion. A deficiency in one or both ( even poorly maintained temps in the enclosure , which aids digestion can be an added factor) can lead to brittle bones or soft spongy bones. This occurs over time as the calcium levels drop in their blood supply. As this happens the calcium level in the bones is sidetracked, if you will , from the bones to the blood to maintain more critically needed levels for other bodily functions. As it continues, it can lead to tiny stress fractures in the spine, the long bones in the legs, the jaw, and spongy digits. It is also noticed when it affects their typical climbing and jumping habits. The amount of damage ( ie xray) can help to determine the amount of recovery that is possible. Hence, my question: have you seen him poop. A frog with a damaged spine will not poop which leads to impaction. We think we make it ‘all better’ when we soak them --- they poop—and we are happy. This , many times, is treating a symptom --not the cause. MBD – in the beginning-- is more than what meets the eye . Proper husbandry is critical as all aspects of “poor” care begin to affect their health on so many levels. It’s a spiral ! ( ie specifically, temps, feeder maintenance, dusting habits, water maintenance- the list goes on)

To prevent this , requires a constant vigil of care. Don’t we know it !! Intense observation day -to-day of the frogs behavior we keep, is vitally important.
---------------------
Ie: last night my oldest red eyed tree frog was sitting at the bottom of the enclosure; sitting, hanging out, hunting.-----I observed the usual nightly gathering at the water hole ! I open the door and it startles him a little. He RUNS, I mean runs to the top of the the enclosure- gets there in a flash . If this behavior, overtime, were to begin to disappear I would re-evaluate my current habits of how diligent I've been in maintaining the food supply- FIRST. Our feeders are nothing compared to their varied diets in the wild.
------------------------------------------------
Quick little review:
-replace all supplements every 3 months ( it’s terrible they come in such lage containers)
-store it in a cool DARK place
-mix up the use of different – respected- products
-keep a written – dusting schedule- which will adds to consistent efforts
-don’t leave crickets in the enclosure! Watch how quickly they can clean themselves off! There is a reason they have been around for 400 million years? They are quite proficient!
-feed right before the lights go out !
-dust crickets with calcium and Vit Ds ( cricket exoskeletons are high in phosphorous) Dusting helps to accomplish a better calcium to phosphorous ratio of which experts say should be 2:1 ( calcium : phosphorous) This ratio is needed for the frogs to use the supplements properly.
-gut loading the crickets w/ calcium sources –gel, veggies – we want them to be ‘fortified’

[U]Small----- high in calcium food list: Use thos left overs ! ( most of these should be on the menu everyday for the humans-walk to the cricket bin !)

(Kale, Turnip Greens, Arugula, Broccoli Rabe , Okra, Oranges, ( even OJ on a cotton ball) Kelp, Spinach, crushed Sesame Seeds, Broccoli)

This is great food: Insectivores : Purrs and Waggs Healthy Pets

Check out the ingredients! Fresh - short shelf life = fresh - whole food source of nutrition for the crickets

Unfortunately, there is very little regulation in the industry about the manufacturer’s claims on the supplement label. This makes our jobs even harder combined with even less funded research needed by our passionate research scientists.

A basic we can understand - concentrate on the food ! We are...........what we eat!