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Thread: The search for the "perfect" "foam" substrate ...

  1. #1
    100+ Post Member emandkel's Avatar
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    Default The search for the "perfect" "foam" substrate ...

    As some know, I house many of my pacman frogs on foam and have been for at least 2 - 3 months I think. I purchased "air filter" foam from Grainger, 1/4 inch foam, due to a post saying someone used it for fish. I use 3 layers of foam with about 1/4 inch of water (or less) in the bottom of their tub container.

    However, it is lightweight and fairly easily moved -- some of my frogs like to get under one or more layers of foam, and if they "burrow" to the bottom that defeats the purpose of the foam keeping them out of their waste/urine in the water. The bigger frogs are starting to tear small holes in it in their attempts to burrow. Furthermore, more searching on the internet leads to the possibility it may not be safe and could have mold inhibitor and/or fire retardent in it (not necessarily Grainger foam, just foam in general that is not made for ponds/fish).

    In my attempt to find another solution, I have tried a few other things:

    1) Pond filter foam, about 1 in thick, comes in a package of 2 and roughly 1 foot square (a bit rectangular). Cons: expensive, and doesn't seem to "drain" as well as the Grainger foam. Plus it can be hard to really clean well. Pros: fish safe, sturdy.

    2) The lime green filter media from Drs Foster and Smith (someone posted a link on this recently). But as was mentioned, seems to be fairly rough for frog use. Currently being tried in two containers, covered with one layer of Grainger foam, but this all uses vertical space and space is limited in the tubs I use. The thing I do like about this arrangement is that the Grainger foam is more stable with a rough surface beneath it -- I'm thinking they can't move that foam now. They can not move the green filter media as it is stiff. I am thinking the green filter media, due to it being stiff, is going to be hard to clean well.

    3) Light green pond filter media from another internet source. Looks similar to #2, haven't used it yet.

    4) The "blue" stuff (blue on one side, white on the other, fish filter media). Softer then #1 or #2, and a bit thinner (about 3/4" thick). But flimsy and easily moved by the frogs and they can also tear holes in it.

    I have also looked at Poret pond/fish filter foam -- looks good, sounds like it may be a good possibility, but is expensive. Could have similar cons to #1, though.

    Any comments, suggestions, etc would be greatly appreciated.

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  3. #2
    Locascio
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    Default RE: The search for the "perfect" "foam" substrate ...

    I'm sorry I don't think frogs like the pacman or pixie should be housed on filter, seeing as how they are frogs that burrow and even you say thay try and hide under it thay are trying to tell you maybe thay don't like it. Not to say it can't be done without harm I've seen this set up used and produce large healthy frogs but we seem to forget about the mental status of are beloved frog

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  4. #3
    Janice
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    Default Re: The search for the "perfect" "foam" substrate ...

    I switched my african bullfrog to a foam substrate tonight. I will keep you all posted on how it goes. I had a untreated piece of foam that I cut to the shape of the aquarium. I made a ramp he can move around to get from a lower level to a upper level. I cut a small hole big enough for him to "burrow" into and just have his eyes showing like he does in the dirt. And I dug out a large amount of foam for him to go in under like a rock ledge.
    To clean you remove frog and pull out foam and rinse in the sink, put it back in with dechlornated water just so the water is about 1 1/2 inch deep. When I put in crickets you don't have the drowning issue because they just drink from the foam. Keeps the humidity level up. So far I like it, it is going to be easier then him dragging all that dirt and coconut back into the water with him. Or filling his water bowl up with dirt. We will see if I have down sides to this method I will post as well. I was at a pet store today and this is how they kept most of their frogs, that weren't aquatic. I am thrilled about it for now we will see what happens. Doug seems content he is in his little dug out hole and he seems perfectly content. I know a clean frog probably is not how it is supposed to be but he smells better!

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    Moderator Lija's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search for the "perfect" "foam" substrate ...

    ok, i know it is controversial issue, but when people are keeping burrowing frogs on a foam i see this:
    1. mental issue as Locastio mentioned, they live in a dirt not foam in nature.
    2. stress out frog due to every day changes in his home, foam has to be rinsed every single day, thus frog needs to be taken out every single day.
    3. it is really convenient for a human? you have to rinse the foam in treated water every day, i don't even want to think how long will it take me to do so having a foam in my enclosures.
    4. health issue for a frog, try to burrow in something synthetic when your skin is so delicate or if to cut a hole in it, then frog forced to sit on a glass or a foam have to be very thick.
    5. aesthetic point of view. the enclosure doesn't look natural. period. i can justify when breeders keep theirs on paper towels that are more natural media, but when you have one or 2 frogs you want to enjoy them and their enclosure, to have it pleasant to your eye, i enjoy mini nature creations, not something artificial and foamy

    my belief is that if we take exotic animals to our homes we are obligated to provide them with as natural to them environment as possible this way ensure long and healthy life.

    I don't mean to offend anyone who keep their frogs on a foam, I'm just saying i would never do that personally for above mentioned reasons.
    Save one animal and it doesn't change the world, but it surely changes the world for that one animal!

  6. #5
    100+ Post Member emandkel's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search for the "perfect" "foam" substrate ...

    A few comments:

    From what I understand, keeping on foam ... as long as they are NOT in direct contact with the water ... is cleaner and safer for the frogs. The foam allows any urine to pass through and they are not sitting in their own waste (as long as the poop is cleaned up). Someone had said that when the enclosure is kept like this (on foam, water level below foam top), then the water and foam do not need to be cleaned every day and once a week is fine. This is the time span I have followed and except for my biggest frogs, this seems to work. I clean the ones with the largest frogs in them twice a week, due to the urine smell building up. They do each have water bowls and that water is changed daily, but most do not seem to use them.

    They DO try to burrow, and can even dig into the green filter material. Some seem happier and more likely to eat when they have a hide; others do not care. I have plans to make hides out of thick foam in the future or some other hide if I can find something suitable that is big enough for the frog yet small enough to fit across the back of my tubs.

    The main issue I've run into is keeping the frog's skin moist. I mist their tubs twice a day and carefully and gently mist the frogs as well, avoiding the face. They usually don't even flinch. It is for this reason as well as frequent cleaning I may switch back to coco-earth. On the other hand, I've found that most of the frogs kept on foam will eat more. For feeding, it keeps the food clean ... and allows me to drop worms in front of those frogs who want to see worm movement before striking, without the worry about the worm getting coco-fiber on it. And I love the look of a "clean" frog (versus coco-fiber on them).

  7. #6
    100+ Post Member pac's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search for the "perfect" "foam" substrate ...

    I like eco earth i have tried that and water my pacs didnt like if you have a rack like i got and its dark it may work pretty good.another substrate i like to use is spagum moss .The frogs love the moss and they will show beautiful.if you like stick with but i hate that squeaky sound they make when they get to the bottom
    Ceratophyrs and African Bullfrog Keeper For Life

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